V1 LSJ SC HP Tuners Log Data - 27PSI?! 162F IAT

[Gtstorey]

I’m concerned with the way it doesn’t come back down even out of boost but still driving. See what it comes down to with a steady 5-10 minutes of cruising and not in boost.

 

[Joebob]

By far not an expert, but is your dual pass plumbed correctly. Usually I see the center as the entrance and the ends are the outlets. It really bepends on how the cores were set up. Having the center and one end as outlets could cause you to be pushing water into both ends of the pipe and deadheading th laminova cores. Please correct me if wrong.

Joe

 

[GoblinGuyZ]

By far not an expert, but is your dual pass plumbed correctly. Usually I see the center as the entrance and the ends are the outlets. It really bepends on how the cores were set up. Having the center and one end as outlets could cause you to be pushing water into both ends of the pipe and deadheading th laminova cores. Please correct me if wrong.


View attachment 38563
Joe

Hmmm you could be right, it's genuinely acting like its not connected right. Will check in when I get back home and compare. I followed ZZPs video in stall so I'm fairly sure I have the cores inside setup correctly but the plumbing maybe not.

 

[GoblinGuyZ]

I’m concerned with the way it doesn’t come back down even out of boost but still driving. See what it comes down to with a steady 5-10 minutes of cruising and not in boost.

Yes exactly my thoughts, its not even just the temp but how it doesn't react as tho it's receiving any cooling even when driving normally after a pull.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Question: couldn't quite see, do you have the fan on the DF heat exchanger? It is set up to pull air up through the HE and not pushing down through the HE? One thing to try is taping in a piece of rigid cardboard into the open area directly behind the radiator to close off this space to keep the radiator hot air from escaping under the car and warming the air the HE is pulling from below. Improving the air flow management at the front of the car can help with proper cooling and aerodynamics too. Just trying to think of minor things that could improve your situation. Edit: or install a splitter!

 

[GoblinGuyZ]

Question: couldn't quite see, do you have the fan on the DF heat exchanger? It is set up to pull air up through the HE and not pushing down through the HE? One thing to try is taping in a piece of rigid cardboard into the open area directly behind the radiator to close off this space to keep the radiator hot air from escaping under the car and warming the air the HE is pulling from below. Improving the air flow management at the front of the car can help with proper cooling and aerodynamics too. Just trying to think of minor things that could improve your situation. Edit: or install a splitter!

yes good suggestions and I think that would help in small ways for sure that add up but I still feel I have a more serious issue and I'm leaning towards the hoses being hooked up wrong possibly but will find out. Thanks

 

[snirtman]

By far not an expert, but is your dual pass plumbed correctly. Usually I see the center as the entrance and the ends are the outlets. It really bepends on how the cores were set up. Having the center and one end as outlets could cause you to be pushing water into both ends of the pipe and deadheading th laminova cores. Please correct me if wrong.


View attachment 38563
Joe

I'm in the middle of my ZZP dual pass install also and I found their install instructions pretty confusing. I had to label mine to try to keep it straight:

So "cool" water enters in the middle, hot water comes out top and bottom. I also wonder about plumbing the pump - it would seem better for pump efficiency and longevity to have it pump "cool" water into the engine rather than pump "hot" water out of the engine. Thoughts??

 

[Gtstorey]

I'm in the middle of my ZZP dual pass install also and I found their install instructions pretty confusing. I had to label mine to try to keep it straight:



So "cool" water enters in the middle, hot water comes out top and bottom. I also wonder about plumbing the pump - it would seem better for pump efficiency and longevity to have it pump "cool" water into the engine rather than pump "hot" water out of the engine. Thoughts??

typically you would try to pump after the heat exchanger and before the intercooler but I'm not sure how much 150? degree will actually shorten the life of the pump.

 

[Chubbs]

typically you would try to pump after the heat exchanger and before the intercooler but I'm not sure how much 150? degree will actually shorten the life of the pump.

The pump portion isn't what fails, it's the electric motor. The motor has nothing to do with the temperature of the coolant, as it's never in contact with it.

It may be good engineering practice to have the pump in contact with cooler water, but functionally I don't see it making a difference here.

 

[Gtstorey]

The pump portion isn't what fails, it's the electric motor. The motor has nothing to do with the temperature of the coolant, as it's never in contact with it.

It may be good engineering practice to have the pump in contact with cooler water, but functionally I don't see it making a difference here.

Of course it depends on the particular pump. It used to be common for people to use a bilge pump as an “upgrade” and those wouldn’t last anytime on the hot side as they were designed for cold water only.

 

[Tinkles]

I forget the part number, but I do remember there being a Mercedes Benz intercooler pump that was identical to the LSJ pump that had a higher flow rate.

 

[Scott #321]

Of course it depends on the particular pump. It used to be common for people to use a bilge pump as an “upgrade” and those wouldn’t last anytime on the hot side as they were designed for cold water only.

I use the frozen boost bildge pump and have not had any issues for a year and a half. Intercooler only on the lnf just doesn't heat that hot. No warranty but so far so good. I do pump from the bottom of the heat exchanger up to the intercooler so the fluid has been cooled to its maximum amount before entering the pump.

 

[mike_sno]

All my logic and experience with pumps is telling me: The suction side of the pump is where you have the majority of losses. The Intercooler pump is as far as I see it a centrifugal pump. Means, use gravity to help as much as possible on the suction side. In other words, place the pump at the lowest spot in the circuit. I think it‘s favorable to increase the water flow as much as possible, how to do that? Avoid obstacles in the flow path. E.G. For the dual pass, use a Y instead of a T where the 2 outlet hoses join. Regarding temperature, @Gtstorey is right, heat transfers from the pump to motor and the motor and its bearings have temperature ranges. I would place it at the coolest point. Anyway, at the LSJ this is after the Radiator. Really, GM thought pretty good about where and why the placed the pump where they did.

I overhauled my pool pump and completely optimized the flow of the pool pump. Reduced the energy consumption and increase the flow of the system. I measured the loss which a 90degree elbow had, it was 30Watts per elbow at 30Gal/min. Replacing it with 2x45 or 90 degree elbows with a larger radius helped a lot.

I just ordered my dual pass plate. Are you guys seeing a significant heat drop?

 

[Gtstorey]

As a closed loop system, it won’t make much difference how low the pump is, as long as it is low enough that any air trapped in the system isn’t getting pulled through. With the exception of initial fill.

In an open system it makes some difference, but as long as you meet net positive head required, it’s fine.

 

[mike_sno]

Agreed, it doesn’t make much of a difference. It’s anyway in the optimal position. But I don‘t think our system is truly a closed system.

Exited to get my dual pass and run some test before and after.

 

[Gtstorey]

LNF system from df is a closed loop. I don’t know about the LSJ actually. But it will be hard for it to not be a closed loop.

 

[mike_sno]

Regarding different intercooler pumps, has someone tested what the flow (gpm) of the standard pump is?

RVs have 12V fresh water pumps. Maybe one of those could be a better alternative.

 

[Gtstorey]

Flow measurement on a pump doesn’t mean anything with comparing what the head is.
There are charts in the internet comparing flow at a reasonable pressure you would be expecting for a supercharger cooling system. They include a lot of the various alternatives from cheap to expensive.

You can always run two pumps. My Camaro has two.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Pump head is not really a factor when pushing fluid less than 3 feet vertically. Let's not over complicate the answer for this discussion, not everyone understands what pump head is or how it affects pressure, flow and efficiency.

Simple answer, coolant pressure needed for a cooling circuit is typically low, less than 15 psi, but that would be at the coolant reservoir/tank. this would ensure if your using a radiator reserve tank with a 15 psi cap the system will not try to overflow the extra pressure. Flow pressure will vary within the system, but a pump with an output that is about 35-45 psi (which is outlet pressure) and can flow 2 gpm or better should a capable replacement. Hope this help.

 

[Gtstorey]

head is not just elevation. It’s friction head also. You put in 15ft of 3/4 or 5/8 tubing a half dozen fittings, a heat exchanger, intercooler, and that adds up to more than 3 feet if you are moving the water fast.