V1 Joe's 2009 F40 SS/TC #470

[comegetjoe]

Hopefully he’s bringing a leak down tester too

Nope.

 

[comegetjoe]

Compression numbers came back. I expected one cylinder to be lower than the rest, but not a cylinder thats not causing problems.
Cold, 4-1 - 115, 130, 100, 120
Warm4-1 - 132, 137, 115, 132
Warm is not hot, just enough to open the thermostat.

None of this is worrying to me for a few reasons. 1. This motor has 155k on it and you know in the cobalt world, thats A LOT of abuse. 2. I have a back up sandcast motor thats been rebuilt and is sitting on deck waiting, just waiting for its chance to more power than this motor. 3. I have no smoke, no fouled plugs, no misfires coming from the low cylinder and the car doesnt smell bad like oil. 4. Its the end of the season for me. Ive got a newborn, don't have time to swap a motor out this season and all I can do is work with the tuner to get this motor ironed out.

If im wrong, Im always open to someone telling me their thoughts.

 

[Rttoys]

Can you swap injectors to see if the misfire moves?

 

[comegetjoe]

Can you swap injectors to see if the misfire moves?

Feasible, yes. Will it suck? yes. They're underneath the intake manifold.
From ZZP's website - "They are also extremely delicate so they will come pre-installed in a specific fuel rail to decrease the chance of damaging the injector and for an easier install." While I'm sure I can be delicate enough, these things have 50-60 miles on them tops and shouldn't be hanging or sticking this early in the game.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Brand new parts can fail (infant mortality in aerospace speak) and I'm sure they are not 100% tested before the injector set is assembled. And yes, getting to the injectors is a major task - one of the negatives of the LNF, but a common fact of life since almost every engine now is DI.

Go take care of the family, they are most important in life. The Goblin will still be waiting when you get the time. Taking a break can sometimes be a good thing!

 

[Rttoys]

Unfortunately “new” doesn’t mean “good”. Working on vehicles everyday for the last 30 years, I have seen the decline in quality of parts. Over the last 5 years or so, they have really gone downhill. Not knocking zzp, it’s industry wide. Since I mostly work on GM vehicles, I use AC Delco a lot and even they have been on a decline over the last few years. It’s just sad. all I’m saying is I have had to add “failed new part” way up on the list starting my diagnosing now.

I didn’t think swapping them would be easy, like my LSJ.

 

[comegetjoe]

Well, tuner didnt seem to mind the numbers, but wants me to swap out injector positions. I guess Ill be learning how opel injectors are removed from and installed into the fuel rail.

Lets just cross out fingers this misfire transfers right away and no leaks upon reassembly.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Since you will have the intake removed, recommended replacing the PCV (unless it is brand new already) and possibly some intake port and back of valve cleaning if the engine has some miles on it.

 

[Markm]

Well, tuner didnt seem to mind the numbers, but wants me to swap out injector positions. I guess Ill be learning how opel injectors are removed from and installed into the fuel rail.

Lets just cross out fingers this misfire transfers right away and no leaks upon reassembly.

Is the option to perform an injector balance on your scan tool?

 

[comegetjoe]

Is the option to perform an injector balance on your scan tool?

I believe so, but what's the second half to your thought?

 

[Markm]

I believe so, but what's the second half to your thought?

Sorry I wasn’t thinking that far ahead. If you can perform the injector balance it will prime the fuel system (with fuel pressure gauge attached) and flow test each injector and all you need to do is record the pressure drops. If you have more than a 2 psi variance on the cylinder in question then it is likely you have an injector issue. If all the injectors flow the same than the injector is not likely the issue. That way you wouldn’t need to take the chance of messing up good parts

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Don't forget the LNF injectors run at much higher pressure than the LSJ/NA injectors coming off the high pressure pump - recalling something like 2000 PSI? Much care needs to be taken if measuring flow rate. Fluids/gasoline under this high pressure could be injected into/through your hand or could take body parts off if handled improperly. Please be careful.

 

[comegetjoe]

I wont be flow testing anything. I dont even want to pull the injectorz from the rail. ZZP is getting a whole rail back, they can flow test they're injectors and tell me if whay they sold me malfunctioning.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Best option for sure. Hopefully they will find something, since you've pretty much exhausted all the other options. Need to get this fixed so you can finally get your Goblin on the road - more than a few laps around the neighborhood.

 

[comegetjoe]

Just gonna leave this here.
Yes. This is the misfiring cylinder.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Never having a DI rail and injectors apart, I'm guessing the separate blue piece is supposed to be attached like the other injector?

 

[comegetjoe]

Never having a DI rail and injectors apart, I'm guessing the separate blue piece is supposed to be attached like the other injector?

Yes.

I pulled #3 and it has a pin attached.
I pulled #1 and it has no pin attached.
I pulled #4 and it has a pin attached.
The pin for #1 was inside of the fuel rail. I was able to retrieve it with a pair of needle nose.

Im excited to see the cartoon arrow and curious to see what ZZP has to say about it.

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

These are Cobalt injectors or Opel injectors? I'm curious to know if the extra 13% flow capacity is needed for higher HP with gasoline (I'm sure they are probably required if using E85). An alternative could be the 5th injector kit from ZZP if more fuel is needed - and it has the added benefit of hitting the back of the intake valves with fuel to help reduce carbon build up.

 

[comegetjoe]

Opels. Which is why im kinda upset.

There is definitely build up on the intake ports after these, we'll call it 60miles from now on, so I see meth or 5th fuel injector in the future.

 

[Robinjo]

Is the first one (lefthand side of the photo of three) supposed to be bent? Or is just an illusion of the photo angle?