New upper control arm design.

[95Blitz]

So Dale E came up with the idea that a new upper control arm might be needed. The new arm would make camber adjustment simple no need to remove the bolt in the big rod end to make adjustments. It would be a finer adjustment also. Here is what I have came up with so far design wise.

This is still missing the adjustable part, but will look like this.

I haven't pulled the stock one off yet to test the fit.

Does anyone have a tubing bender that will bend 1" DOM? If so are you willing to bend 1 arm up so I can test the design?

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

I'm scratching my head how this all fits together? Where do the poly bushings go? Or is it just the LH/RH adjusters with the heims that mount to the ends (frame side) of the new a-arms?

 

[95Blitz]

Or is it just the LH/RH adjusters with the heims that mount to the ends (frame side) of the new a-arms?

Just the adjustable part.

 

[Gtstorey]

I'm not sure that an adjuster with that long of a bending moment will be strong enough. Maybe the bottom arm would be strong enough to carry it, but there is a reason you don't really see A arms with that long of an adjuster.

 

[95Blitz]

You might be right the adjustable section would be 2.5ish inches or so long in this design. But different threaded inserts could be bought to make that distance shorter. The a arm will need to be redesigned anyway, hitting the spring.

 

[Ross]

Are you guys fixing a problem that doesn't exist?
Removing the bolt in the big rod end to make adjustments isn't that difficult.

 

[duthehustle93]

This is a pretty common and proven practice for adding camber adjustment to double wishbone setups... I think this is what he's suggesting?

I'm not sure that an adjuster with that long of a bending moment will be strong enough. Maybe the bottom arm would be strong enough to carry it, but there is a reason you don't really see A arms with that long of an adjuster.

I'm pretty sure he's intending to run heim joints at all ends (as we currently have) in which case the only bending load that exists would be resultant from resistance within the bearings which is pretty negligible. If the heim joints weren't setup correctly or lock-nutted at the limit of their travel, then they'd bottom out and impart a bending load which would be very bad.

 

[David]

Are you guys fixing a problem that doesn't exist?
Removing the bolt in the big rod end to make adjustments isn't that difficult.

Was thinking to myself the same thing. Was about to ask what the issue your having. Im assuming its just the convenience for the alignment.

If anything I believe I read that the needed upgrade to the front is moving the arms up if I remember correctly.

 

[Rttoys]

Unless you are wanting to shorten the arm, you should be able to drill the threads out of the arm (yellow circle). Add a longer heim and use 2 nuts to secure it (red lines). This would give you the same adjustment abilities.

 

[95Blitz]

Are you guys fixing a problem that doesn't exist?
Removing the bolt in the big rod end to make adjustments isn't that difficult.

This wouldn't be for everyone. But some (maybe) would want to drive to the track with street camber then adjust to a race setup and revert back to street setup for the ride home. I flat tow mine to autocross and would like to visit other regions in my area that are 2 hours or so away.

 

[95Blitz]

Unless you are wanting to shorten the arm, you should be able to drill the threads out of the arm (yellow circle). Add a longer heim and use 2 nuts to secure it (red lines). This would give you the same adjustment abilities.
View attachment 56652
View attachment 56653

That is one of Dale's ideas also. I think I'm going to try that way first.

 

[95Blitz]

New A arms are on order...

 

[Rttoys]

This wouldn't be for everyone. But some (maybe) would want to drive to the track with street camber then adjust to a race setup and revert back to street setup for the ride home. I flat tow mine to autocross and would like to visit other regions in my area that are 2 hours or so away.

You would need to adjust toe also, if you move camber. toe Will kill tires faster than camber will.

Or run 2 or 4 wheels with street tires when towing and swap to race tires when you get there.

 

[Gtstorey]

Buy a trailer or a car dolly.

 

[Dale E]

I apologize to @95Blitz for suggesting a rod end tweaking to help with a very occasional adjustment. Its a use case thing for the racing community. Stock street driven Goblins don't need it. I guess if your not a serious racer you don't need it either.

I apologize to the Goblin community for not building my own Goblin so I could mess it all up with my whacky ideas.

There is NO problem with the stock Goblin UCA rod end or UCA itself. Drive your cars and have fun!

I apologize to @Desert Sasqwatch and @Sebnuts for their modifications to suspension (I'll take the blame for that too - maybe they should reverse back to stock design). I apologize to @Rttoys for muffler material and ideas and independent rear suspension ideas (had a potential demo item at one Goblinfest) To @Rttoys , @Desert Sasqwatch , @Ross for various other suspension things. I apologize to the community for long ago suggesting different power trains. Now, there is an electric, V8 and Honda V1.

For the V1, buy the factory designed upgrades for suspension. Buy a newly designed V2 with even more factory designed improvements. My suggested change to @95Blitz cost is a new rod end -- so a cheap option. He wisely is being safe with a new UCA as well.

The Goblin community has always supported builders -- support one builder in his taking a risk and changing things.

So much controversy I've caused. Fading to the watch post only mode!

 

[Ross]

No need to apologize. Learning involves making mistakes, and dreaming up wild ideas just makes you a visionary, an inventor. You have tons of experience and have helped me personally many, many times. No goblin needed.

 

[Rttoys]

No need to apologize dale. I love your input. You are old school like me. The things I’m working on you have suggested just take time and concentration, which I don’t have at the moment. I’d like to think my goblin is as good as it is due to your input. We always talk in the background and a lot of my mods are due to your input. We can’t buy stuff out of a catalog, we have to design and build it. It’s a different level and Im glad other are there to go outside the norm and do it, but it wouldn’t be possible without help from people like you.

 

[David]

I apologize to @95Blitz for suggesting a rod end tweaking to help with a very occasional adjustment. Its a use case thing for the racing community. Stock street driven Goblins don't need it. I guess if your not a serious racer you don't need it either.

I apologize to the Goblin community for not building my own Goblin so I could mess it all up with my whacky ideas.

There is NO problem with the stock Goblin UCA rod end or UCA itself. Drive your cars and have fun!

I apologize to @Desert Sasqwatch and @Sebnuts for their modifications to suspension (I'll take the blame for that too - maybe they should reverse back to stock design). I apologize to @Rttoys for muffler material and ideas and independent rear suspension ideas (had a potential demo item at one Goblinfest) To @Rttoys , @Desert Sasqwatch , @Ross for various other suspension things. I apologize to the community for long ago suggesting different power trains. Now, there is an electric, V8 and Honda V1.

For the V1, buy the factory designed upgrades for suspension. Buy a newly designed V2 with even more factory designed improvements. My suggested change to @95Blitz cost is a new rod end -- so a cheap option. He wisely is being safe with a new UCA as well.

The Goblin community has always supported builders -- support one builder in his taking a risk and changing things.

So much controversy I've caused. Fading to the watch post only mode!

No need to apologize at all, thats what this community is all about. Great and wacky ideas that can come to life with the help and ideas of everyone. Two minds 3 minds 20 minds is better then one. Keep up the suggestions and inputs it helps everyone out.

I got excited when I read the headline. I was like what another mod to buy lol

 

[Desert Sasqwatch]

Dale, if it weren't for our conversations and trading of ideas, I would be building a really boring and run of the mill Goblin. Your inspiration to think outside of the box and try something different definitely made me think of the modifications and improvements that can take a good kit to the next level towards being a great build that meets all of my expectations for uniqueness and sensibilities for safety. This forum needs your inputs - please continue to participate when your sage advice is needed.

 

[Scott #321]

Dale, you are the embodiment of human creativity. Good enough is never good enough, always tweaking, always looking for a slight edge. If not for minds like yours we would all still be riding in wagons pulled by horses. Innovation is never without some form of resistance but those with the courage to ask, what if, create legend. Everyone driving or enjoying the Goblin lifestyle owes a tip of the hat to this creativity from this (possibly crazy) mentality of someone daring to say, what if, and then having the courage to act. I salute you Dale and all on in the community with the courage to push forward, always innovating, always reaching for improvement.